Edit parameters values while modulating

I would like a way to edit parameter values while modulating a paramater. Currently if you are modulating a parameter and want to change it’s values, you have to click the modulator arrow to stop modulating a parameter, then edit the parameter, then press the modulation arrow again if you want to keep modulating.

Probably something like hold ctrl or alt while modulating to edit the values would be my idea.

This would be a gamechanger for workflow especially when sound designing.

Can you elaborate?
What I understood was:
Parameter: Some Parameter e.g. from some VST
Modulator: E.g. A LFO modulator modulating that parameter

Now you want to change the parameter? This works for me, I can change it with the mouse or insert a value with the keyboard by clicking the parameter while holding ctrl.

Or did you mean adjusting the Modulation strength, i.e. the blue circle? But clicking the arrow does not stop modulation for me, and you can adjust that comfortably in the inspector if you click on the modulator.

I think OP meant automation. Changing parmeter values while they are being automated disables corresponding automation lanes, until green arrow button at the top is pressed.

Instead of modifiers, maybe we can right-click on the arrow, then a menu pops up, then choose to auto re-enable automation of touched parameters.

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Ah, that makes more sense.
“Restore Automation Control” would be the correct term. (You can also do it for individual parameters by righ clicking them).
So: an option for the the automation control to be restored automatically after x ms of the last manual / change of the parameter?

No guys, I’ll try to explain this better.

So you have an lfo and you want to modulate the index in polymer so basically you are scanning the wavetable with the lfo. Okay so how do you do this? Well you press the lfo modulation arrow, then you modulate the index. Now what if you want to change the index value to move further up on the wavetable? Well I have to click on the lfo modulator arrow to get out of modulation mode, then I can change the index value up to move up the wavetable.

The feature I want, is instead of pressing the lfo modulator arrow to turn it off then change the index, I want to hold ctrl to temporarily turn off the lfo modulator and change the value. Now after I change the value while holding ctrl, I can let go of ctrl to go back to modulating with the lfo. Then I can keep adding modulations with regular mouse or bypass the modulator quickly holding ctrl to change the values (without modulating).

Do you guys understand what I mean? This would be extremely helpful.

Still not really sure, I give it another try…
you are NOT talking about changing the modulation strength, i.e. The LFO Range starts at Wavetable one and has it’s max at wavetable 4 and you want to be quickly able to change the max to 6.
Thats NOT what you mean, right?

Are you maybe talking about changing the start index?
i.e. Wavetable selected, while the modulation is at zero. You want to be able to move that start point?
If so it can be easily and elegantly done by first using a macro modulator over all possible start points, select the start point (then maybe modulate that macro instead)

Or still something different?

Uploaded a vid trying to explain this: Bitwig Studio Edit Parameters While Modulating - YouTube

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Ahh, I got it.

But what about toggle? Switching between last touched modulation mode and normal mode back and forth.
Or… maybe the best approach could be something like serum phase-plant offers. Showing a list of incoming modulation and changing the amount without having to go into modulation mode.

Ok now I get it.

Edit parameters values while modulating” is quite confusing title, since the modulation still happens when leaving the mapping mode. I think the important keyword would be modulation mapping mode or something similar

Something like this maybe:

An option to change the value of the parameter instead of the strength of the modulation while still being in the modulation mapping mode, by holding down some key.

What you mean by toggle?

You can already do the second part in the inspector panel. It’s just not a quick workflow since especially since you can’t visually see how much modulation you applying like when you do it with over the knobs.

Okay, thanks I’ll change the title and description.

How do I edit my post and title? I can only edit my comments in here

I can edit my posts, but I don’t think one can edit titles. But maybe you should make a feature draft anyway?
If my description correctly captured your wish I think it is a clearly defined feature, ready for the drafting phase.

Currently you can press ESC to go out of modulation mapping mode. But can’t go back without clicking on the arrow button again. We can have a shortcut like ~ which switch between normal mode, and modulation mapping mode of last tweaked modulator.

Wow, I didn’t know I can press escape to get out of it, that’s super helpful forreal. Thanks

And I like your idea alot. So like a “toggle last tweaked modulator” What y’all think?

ctrl + alt + click is currently free, but I would not do it as a toogle switch but having the switch active while holding down the keys
So this could work:
While in Modulation Mapping Mode:

  • hold ctrl + alt and drag the mouse to adjust the true value of the Parameter

While in normal Mode:

  • hold ctrl + alt and drag the mouse to adjust the modulation strength of the last changed modulator
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I don’t like modifier approach for two reasons

  • Modifiers should have consistent meaning cross the software and should be related to the action as much as possible. Here, switching between two modes is less related to ‘knob/slider actions’ than other things like ‘type in values’, ‘reset to default’, ‘tweak more precisely’.

  • It’s less simple. After adjusting parameter with modifier, it will put user back to modulation mode. It involves more mode switching.

Yet, modifier approach can solve shortcut problem nicely. Tab is best for switching stuff back and forth but it is quite occupied. No headache with modifier approach.

Lastly, I thought about ‘Last tweaked modulator’ thing and found that it can get vague. What should happen when an hour passes after editing modulation? I think arrow buttons should be selectable or can be highlighted. So the switching should happen with ‘selected modulation output’.

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Good point with the consistent meaning. That could really get super confusing. Hm…

I think the last tweaked modulator works though. Having the arrow buttons somehow selectable would involve a new button or place to click on the modulator and I think the modulator already have like 3 different reactions depending on where you click them. Adding more would definitely be messy.
Expect maybe we could do “last selected” (selected as in clicking on it as currently possible) modulator instead of “last tweaked”. This would work without implementing a new kind of “selected”.

Then again seeing somehow indicating which modulator is the last selected modulator is of course important…

In Arturia Pigments, there’s a ring outside the knob that you can drag to change the modulation amount. That way, you can both change the knob and the modulation amount at the same time.

So after you start mapping, for each possible target parameter, the ring would become adjustable so you can set the modulation amount.

Honestly, I’m thinking something like how Pigments does it would be better than mapping a key command to last modulator tweeked. I don’t want to request how Pigments does it exactly with the ring part but I do want to stick to my original idea with control.

I think in modulation mapping mode, it eliminates the confusion with what you can and can’t do because it’s straight forward. Everyone knows that when you press the mod arrow, the buttons light up blue or green. So if Bitwig just implements a ctrl shortcut to bypass it while in modulation mapping mode to edit parameters, it’s a system wide implementation that works the same everywhere. There is no ambiguity with “this was the last one tweeked” or whatever.

So simply put, if you hold control while in modulation map mode, it will unhighlight the buttons. When you let go of ctrl, it will go back to map mode with the buttons highlighted. Let me guys know if you think this is a simple, good solution?

I’ve actually been entrenched using the grid so I haven’t really cared to check this out recently. I’d also like to thank Lokanchung again for that escape tip. Also, after I can right click the knob and choose the modulation I want so this has sped up my flow tremendously.